Excessive use of force cases: who watches the watchmen?

We’re all acutely aware how our reaction to a situation as law enforcement officers may sometimes have significant negative costs associated with them, sometimes in the form of criminal or civil punishment. How many times have we all seen a scenario where an officer used an excessive amount of force and was later sued civilly or sentenced to prison? Unfortunately, pretty frequently. But for every time an officer is reprimanded/fired for using force excessively, how many times did he/she use force excessively prior to this? Is it a sudden break in a person’s psyche that caused them to slip, or was their decent into the darkness of malfeasance a slow, yet loud path? More importantly, how are we as law enforcement professionals reacting to and dealing with the situation at hand?

At the ASU Police Department, no one  at the command level seems to be asking the aforementioned questions (quite frankly, the only questions being asked on the 3rd floor are, “How do we make this blog go away!?”). We’re pretty impressed there seems to be accountability within the officer ranks, but what happens when your command fails you?

One Cpl. is a prime example of an excessive use of force handled poorly at the upper level. Recently, a Cpl. deployed his taser several times on a subject who was restrained and was not an active aggressor. The situation was documented properly, all the ducks were in a row…and then nothing happened (it’s important to note that we are criticizing ASUPD’s response to the situation, not the action itself). At the MINIMUM, why would a department not place the person in question on administrative leave merely to assess the merit of the situation, and to allow that person to mentally recover? No PD that wishes to minimize its legal liability would even dream of letting this person back on the road anytime soon. However, in the parallel universe that is ASUPD, no IA was conducted, and no higher entity reviewed the use of force in this situation.

There are several more use of force incidents that have occurred within the past six months–a rookie officer tasing a subject running away from him, for starters–we know have NOT been investigated by the upper tiers of the department, and definitely not by anyone OUTSIDE the department. There is NO civilian/sworn use of force review panel, NO IAs, and NO information being sent to AZ POST.

Congratulations in hitting a new low, ASUPD; there is no longer even a thin blue line separating line level officers (good guys) from common criminals (bad guys), because command staff has dissolved that line with their inactions and mismanagement.

Welcome to the final frontier of policing, folks.

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13 thoughts on “Excessive use of force cases: who watches the watchmen?

  1. FlamingPileMallcoppery says:

    Keep in mind this is the same moron PHXPD was laughing at for arresting a subject for criminal damage because he wrote on walkway cement with chalk, something kids do everyday. Idiot.

    I was wondering how long it would take for Luke’s excessive use of force, multiple tazing on a handcuffed, non-active agressive subject to become common knowledge, especially with witnesses present. You are exactly right on the admin. leave issue, not happening and it’s total bullshit.

    Corporal No Control Idiot is making a mockery of the profession, the department, and opened the university (and himself) to guaranteed law suit territory. The negligent supervision above him, non-existent leadership is making it happen. Luke has connections to the chief, he brags about it, and obviously it’s true. He should be fired, but he’ll probably get promoted. Chief just keeps playing the odds with state tax payer money.

    Corruption. Different standards for different officers. There are many good reasons this officer got kicked out of the FTO program. He was teaching bad habits, tactics, and behavior in a hostile fashion. He has no business wearing “senior officer” corporal stripes when he is known for making mistakes even rookies don’t even make because they have more competence and self control than his flaming pile bullshit in uniform.

  2. OnefootoutCYA says:

    Now let’s not be too hard on Corporal Krazylid, he doesn’t know any better. He wants to pretend he’s working as a real bad ass cop catching real bad guys in a police fantasy land like south PHX, south LA. I’m sure the guy in handcuffs was really intimidating, scared him into using his tazer, he was fearful for his safety, at least that’s what the use of force paperwork says.

    Any other officer would have been fired out of a carni cannon into their next line of work for a stunt like this. I hope the guy sues Krazylid’s ass off. Maybe that would be a lesson learned and a reality check before he negligently shoots someone, or gets the state sued for millions on the next call.

    The inaction of the department on this issue with this individual underscores many of the things mentioned on Indeed and on this blog. You simply can’t have a different protectionist standard for some and hold everyone else accountable for less.

    Still wondering why we’re losing officers by the score? Here it is, clear as day. Operating without integrity in this profession defeats the purpose, the mission. Get off the pedestals, find some integrity for a change, and maybe you will keep your staffing from leaking out the hole in the wall year after year.

  3. 311 says:

    Normally I would be inclined to err on the side of this being a classic example of why training is so important, why continuous refresher training is essential to running a police department. This is why AZPOST mandates training on important issues year after year.

    However in this case, from what I have heard, the officer who is a supervisor blatantly made a decision to use excessive force without the exigency of needing to do so. There is no excuse for an able bodied officer to use a Taser on a handcuffed prisoner in their custody, especially with other officers present.

    I agree with some of the statements from previous posters, if the department doesn’t take the proper action with this officer then it only further injures the department by undermining the authority of those responsible for the inaction, contributing to low morale and the continued exodus. Nobody likes to work in a good old boy place except for the few with privileges and increasingly that’s all that will be left.

  4. WheresMy907 says:

    Khalid has been out of control for some time, just not caught or held accountable on any count. Talk with people that have been on his calls, he’s all about his version of the truth, telling people what to write in their supplements and bending the truth to justify his actions and events. With ethics like his he’s going to be a ASUPD lifer, no reputable department would tolerate it.

  5. indeedYOUsay says:

    The next officer that gets in trouble for any use of force issue less than assaulting a secured, handcuffed prisoner or questionable ethics issue can use Luke as a reference.

    If it’s OK for him it should be OK for everyone else right? Of course this is completely wrong and should be dealt with, but will it? Chief…your reputation is on the line because someone else soiled theirs and it appears you are doing nothing about it. This is the norm here?

  6. A.I. says:

    I think the comments regarding Khalid are way out of line. This site is NOT the dirty.com. It is not about passing judgement on individual employees, it is to discuss the issues regarding the department’s administration and being held accountable.

    Who here that commented actually witnessed this incident? If you did witness this incident and didn’t report it then you would be EQUALLY responsible for doing nothing. I bet 10 to 1 that no one on here actually witnessed this alleged incident but just heard Khalid did it through the grapevine.

    Try to keep this forum about the facts and not conjecture or personal opinions about employees. You will never win change based on slander, only on FACTS. If it is not a confirmed FACT they don’t but garbage talk about it on here. If you want to blast people go to the dirty.com.

    Personally, I have never observed any issues with Khalid rising to the level of criminal activity. Yeah, he is a bit intense but that is his personality. It doesn’t mean he is beating people down in the streets. As coworkers you have the responsibility to put your coworkers in check, regardless of rank, if they are out of line. Did anyone on here do that if Khalid is so bad? Did anyone pull him on the side and say, “We need to talk. You are doing this, that, etc. and it has me concerned.” I find it more problematic that my coworkers would watch an illegal act and do nothing, than the alleged act itself. If you see illegal or questionable behavior – REPORT IT!!!! Don’t hide behind the veil of the internet and talk crap on your peers.

    Again, YOU are participating in the same behavior that makes ASU PD a shitty place to work. Try looking out for your coworkers and helping them correct their behavior if it is wrong. Weak people stand by and criticize while doing nothing to fix the problem.

    If we are going to win this battle with mis-management and crappy working conditions we need to be united and win on FACT not personal OPINION.

    • theintegrityreport says:

      AI, we made an addition to clarify the message in our original post; we are criticizing ASUPD’s response to the situation, not the action itself.

      Maybe the comments from other posters are out of line, but we think its important that anyone who wishes to express their opinion here is able to, regardless of whether we agree or disagree.

    • WheresMy907 says:

      If you were talking about a bunch of valley girls in highschool you would be right. It’s different when you have worked with people for years at a police department, people you have learned to trust by word and deed. There have been a lot of people who have worked for this department and few have earned their negative reputations as quickly as Luke since he got corporal stripes.

      I didn’t say what I said lightly or on a whim. I said it because people I respect and trust came to me with information that disturbed them. I agree with your comments about reporting unethical behavior, it is the right thing to do. Many of us want to have faith our command will do the right thing, but what are they doing about this? Nothing.

      If you spent any time here you will understand there are different standards for different people, including different standards of ethics, discipline, and accountability. You say we shouldn’t talk about something unless we were there, really? That sounds a little protectionist. I wasn’t at 911, one of our employees was, should we ignore what he says? Should we not have an opinion? I disagree with you on this, but appreciate that you are a voice of dissent where one is needed.

  7. Anoyomous Intel says:

    My point was… unless you witnessed this corrupt act or were involved in it because of proximity then you shouldn’t preach about it. I have documents that show certain things. That is different then someone just taking shots at him. I am not saying to discuss it but don’t speak to it as a fact if you were not there or were not involved. A lot of these comments are from people who have no direct involvement in the issues with Khalid. Some people may just have an axe to grind about him for some other reason and are using this venue to make personal attacks. What troubles me is not being a witness to things and talking about them as if they are gospel. People can say. I think he is a dick, I think he is this or that. I don’t care. I care about saying he violated someone’s rights and no one standing up and doing anything about it.

  8. Justanotherdispensible50 says:

    I tend to agree with the other posters. If you have a group of credible people telling you the stories they personally experienced with Luke (or anyone else) it comes together to form a picture and it’s not a good one. Have you been on patrol with him since the corporal stripes, have you talked with people who have? He’s an expert senior officer now.

    They can manufacture issues for other officers but when another officer like Luke jumps from one pile of shit to the next without a scratch you have to wonder. Is this total bullshit or what? They threaten progressive discipline and do a full IA write up on a guy who forgot to make out his time card, come on.

    In this case we’re talking about Luke, but there are other stories of “special” people getting away with potentially career ending issues. Tempe detained Gaughan on Mill for being drunk and interfering in a couple’s argument, neither of whom wanted him there. They probably could have booked him for DC, not sure if he went hands on, but Tempe was playing nice, unlike Scottsdale with Izzy. Maybe that’s why our rookies can leave for Chandler and he can’t. Did anything Rudy do to get fired amount to what Luke or the other protected people have done? Nope.

    I personally didn’t see Luke hit on nearly every female in our department, but several people told me stories of their experiences and they haven’t just said this about anyone else. Logically if three trustable people tell you something and third parties tell you similar stories then there just might be something to them.

    I didn’t see him draw his Taser on a homeless guy walking away from him, but I trust the person who did. I didn’t see him intimidate subjects into giving permission to search, but I trust the people who did. This latest Taser issue is no different. Once again people are looking the other way because Luke has repeatedly jumped the chain of command, gone directly to the chief, and gets special treatment. Maybe the Orr Boys aren’t protecting him, but it’s just another person doing it when they punished others for much, much less. There has been a lot of talk about different standards for different people, well it’s true and it pisses people off.

    Why are all these people talking about issues with the same person? It must be because they are true. Help him out? He didn’t listen to the subordinate not to taze, he made up his own mind and tazed a handcuffed prisoner in his custody three times, Janda check the Taser, it’s all there.

    As far as talking about something I’ll talk about whatever the hell I want, anyone who says otherwise can kiss my ass. This isn’t a 3rd grade class or a library. When I screw up I know people will talk about me, the situation, no big deal, I really don’t care as long as I come home in one piece. We make mistakes, but the double standard here is despicable. I would have been fired if I behaved like Luke, a “supervisor”. I’m sick of all the lies, the bullshit games, and the double standards. It’s going to be hard to keep water in the buckets with holes like this in them.

  9. Supervisor Facepalm says:

    Ah yes the Luke tasing a handcuffed prisoner three times story. I don’t even know where to begin here. I wasn’t there. The taser keeps a record of deployments. Compare it with statements and see if they add up. Interview the prisoner, look at all the paperwork.

    If, again I wasn’t there, but if Luke did it he should be fired, if another officer covered for him they should be fired, if a supervisor did they should be fired, and all of this should be forwarded to AZPOST for review and possible certification revocation. This is what any other agency would do, maybe with the exception of county.

  10. […] court of public opinion, and the university wanted to fire him/her to save face? Better yet, what about an officer who used excessive force and was never reprimanded or investigated? ASUPD’s ability to initiate and investigate use of force scenarios is arbitrary, at best […]

  11. […] have also mentioned allegations of excessive use of force by Corporal Luke Khalid against a student which was never initially investigated, then subject to an “informal […]

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